TheNextBigWriter Premium → Question about new points charges for edits
Sol,
I am being charged points for Genesis, when I edited my latest chapter but didn't publish a version two. I also played around with editing and changing the book cover.
Are we being assessed points when we simply edit?
Are we being assessed points for customizing our book covers?
Please explain why and when points are deducted other than for publishing chapters.
Thanks.
I am being charged points for Genesis, when I edited my latest chapter but didn't publish a version two. I also played around with editing and changing the book cover.
Are we being assessed points when we simply edit?
Are we being assessed points for customizing our book covers?
Please explain why and when points are deducted other than for publishing chapters.
Thanks.
If you add words to your content while editing, you will be charged extra points. Creating a message to let writers know they have points decucted is one thing on our list of to-do's. In the old system, many writers uploaded a small chapter which cost a set number of points, and then grafted another long section on without paying any additional points. This was, in a sense, a way of cheating the system. Not that everyone did it intentionally. We have closed that loophole.
If you remove content or shorten chapters, nothing is done.
Sol
Thanks for the explanation, Sol. No cheating intended. But if we are now being assessed points for edits, how about a flag on our chapters to show they've been edited and allowing old readers to re-read the revised version for reduced points?
Note: I actually tried to post a version two of the chapter and, unfortunately, I was a fail...
Also, re: reviewing new members (fwc had a question for you about his new membership status, with one premium month awarded to him): I just reviewed fwc's work and received no credit for my time. As I recall, we received full credit for reviewing new members' work. I see no incentive to review them if we get no credit for it.
(In fwc's case, I remember him from the old site, and would have reviewed him
anyway.)
Next, scrolling doesn't always work properly in the windows (e,g., in my review pane, and in this forum post of mine) on the mobile Verizon. (I use iPad a lot.) It won't move down when I go back into the pane to make corrections and changes, unless I hit 'return' and get an extra line that I then have to delete...
Finally, a glitch just appeared on the mobile version - all my capital letters disappeared in my review of fwc's script. I had to go back to edit and add them back in.
Thanks again.
Terri
What happens if you shorten a chapter in the process of editing, and then add the text back? Are you charged for the addback, or does it work on the basis of the max you've ever reached?
I have the same question, if we're changed points to post or edit (if we increase content) but we gain no points reading, it won't take long to go bankrupt. Maybe I'm understanding wrong.
Thanks in advance for the answer
Also, re: reviewing new members (fwc had a question for you about his new membership status, with one premium month awarded to him): I just reviewed fwc's work and received no credit for my time. As I recall, we received full credit for reviewing new members' work. I see no incentive to review them if we get no credit for it.
There was a bug with his membership and that's why he his work didn't pay credit. The bug is fixed and he can now add it back to the group and have it pay credits.
Next, scrolling doesn't always work properly in the windows (e,g., in my review pane, and in this forum post of mine) on the mobile Verizon. (I use iPad a lot.) It won't move down when I go back into the pane to make corrections and changes, unless I hit 'return' and get an extra line that I then have to delete...
We'll look into that. I'll check it again on my iPad.
Finally, a glitch just appeared on the mobile version - all my capital letters disappeared in my review of fwc's script. I had to go back to edit and add them back in.
That's a strange one. Let me know if it happens again or anyone else experiences it. Can you give me the link to the review?
What happens if you shorten a chapter in the process of editing, and then add the text back? Are you charged for the addback, or does it work on the basis of the max you've ever reached?
Post work and then delete, no change in cost points or review points. Then you add back, you will be charged for the add back.
I have the same question, if we're changed points to post or edit (if we increase content) but we gain no points reading, it won't take long to go bankrupt. Maybe I'm understanding wrong.
Thanks in advance for the answer
If the cost of content increases because content was added, so will the amount it pays. So, it all balances out in the end.
Sol, here's my link to my review of fwc's script: http://www.thenextbigwriter.com/view-po … ent-264109
I sure would appreviate the credit.
Also, re the editing charges: thanks for your response. However, I'm not sure that anything will balance out through this iset-up. My issue is: for readers who have already left reviews, shouldn't they be awarded points to re-read the revisions for which I have been charged more points? Granted, the additional revision points for added content aren't that high, but then the re-read should at least gain a few discounted extra points, too.
As you know, the number of reviewers dramatically drops off after the first few chapters, sometimes even after ch 1. Those who stick with a book are already performing a massive service to the writer, and their loyalty is incredible.
It's tough to ask already-loyal but very busy readers to check out a revision (these cost points) when they stand to gain nothing but more demands on their limited time, just because they have become dedicated readers (up to a certain point, anyway), and, often, friends.
Many thanks once again.
What happens if you shorten a chapter in the process of editing, and then add the text back? Are you charged for the addback, or does it work on the basis of the max you've ever reached?
Post work and then delete, no change in cost points or review points. Then you add back, you will be charged for the add back.
So you cut 4,000 words down to 2,000 and reviewers still get credit for 4,000? Then you add 1,500, to 3,500 and you are charged for adding 1,500 even though you're under the original? Do reviewers get extra because you've paid extra?
That's my question, too, njc. (Do reviewers get extra when we get charged extra?)
Also, Sol, when you've gotten some rest, can you look into the other issues I mentioned above?
Thanks again, both for answering everyone's questions so promptly, and for creating this shiny new site!!
What happens if you shorten a chapter in the process of editing, and then add the text back? Are you charged for the addback, or does it work on the basis of the max you've ever reached?
Post work and then delete, no change in cost points or review points. Then you add back, you will be charged for the add back.
That's not what happened when I made two minor changes to two of my chapters. In one, I deleted two words. I was charged 0.22 points. In another, I shortened the Chapter Title by two words. For that, I was charged 0.07 points. Not a big deal in the scheme of things, but it appears we are being charged for ANY edit, regardless if it makes the content shorter or longer, or if we even replace a word with another one.
I used to update typos and revise sentences in response to reviews so new reviewers wouldn't comment on the same problem. Now, because it appears to cost points for any edit, I'll just leave and update in my version off-line.
I think if we're being charged for small extras like this we should be receiving more points for reviewing. Sadly, this is going to keep people from doing edits online.
That's not what happened when I made two minor changes to two of my chapters. In one, I deleted two words. I was charged 0.22 points. In another, I shortened the Chapter Title by two words. For that, I was charged 0.07 points. Not a big deal in the scheme of things, but it appears we are being charged for ANY edit, regardless if it makes the content shorter or longer, or if we even replace a word with another one.
I just tested, adding and removing content. I was charged when I added extra content but was not charged for deleting content. Please point me to the content where you were charged for deleting content.
That's my question, too, njc. (Do reviewers get extra when we get charged extra?)
Also, Sol, when you've gotten some rest, can you look into the other issues I mentioned above?
Thanks again, both for answering everyone's questions so promptly, and for creating this shiny new site!!
Yes, reviewers get extra. Although if you post something that is 1,000 words, delete 500 words, and then add 250 words, you will still be charged the value of the existing post, not the 1,000 + 250.
The goal of this was to close the loophole that many writers took advantage of where they could post a work of 500 words and be charged the commensurate points and then add 3,000 words to it without costing any additional points. In this scenario, a reviewer is reading 3,500 words but only getting points for 500. Let me know if you prefer the old system. We can consider reverting to it but note that in the old system reviewers got screwed quite a bit.
So the expected behavior is that reviewers are paid by the present length and authors pay each time they exceed a previous max?
What happens to inline reviews when the associated text is deleted or edited?
That's not what happened when I made two minor changes to two of my chapters. In one, I deleted two words. I was charged 0.22 points. In another, I shortened the Chapter Title by two words. For that, I was charged 0.07 points. Not a big deal in the scheme of things, but it appears we are being charged for ANY edit, regardless if it makes the content shorter or longer, or if we even replace a word with another one.
I just tested, adding and removing content. I was charged when I added extra content but was not charged for deleting content. Please point me to the content where you were charged for deleting content.
Hi Sol,
Here are the two chapters I changed, and what I did:
1. Chapter 3 of Translate Slowly. The original sentence read: "It would be many years before John would give up the Mustang his father had purchased new in 1969." I deleted "in 1969" so it now reads: "It would be many years before John would give up the Mustang his father had purchased new."
under the points tab, it now shows:
11/15/2014 Post Translate Slowly (a John and Liz Collier mystery) TheNextBigWriter Premium -0.22 88.22
2. Ghost War, Chapter 1. Original title of chapter was "Ghost of a Chance (Ghost Dance sequel)". I deleted all of that and replaced with "Ghost War"
under the points tab, it now shows:
11/15/2014 Post Ghost War (Ghost Dance vol. 2) TheNextBigWriter Premium -0.07 88.15
In both cases, I hit "Update and Submit" after making the changes.
Wow! I always liked being able to edit without using points. I guess that's out. Glad I found this thread. I began to think I was nuts. Funny thing is when I edited without reposting, reviewers could not re-read. If I am charged points for editing, then reviewers should be able to read that updated chapter and get points again. And I guess some folks might have cheated, but adding a sentence or rearranging paragraphs is not cheating. Just seems the principle of being able to get feedback and then apply that is being weakened. I was going back through Broken and applying many of the suggestions I had received without knowing I was now being charged points for the editing. Word count rarely changed more than 50 total words per chapter and often the chapters were shortened. I guess since I'm posting a brand new piece, I'll refrain from posting the edits. And on Broken somehow two chapters have traded places. That's odd. Yep, I was charged points for simply trying to renumber the chapters--make 15, 16 & vice versa.
Wouldn't an uncomplicated way to fix this to be award more points overall? If everyone were earning more for the reviews they do, the cost of small tweaks (which is what most of us are talking about) wouldn't matter in the grand scheme. Significant tweaks that ADD to the total word count, should be assessed based on the # of words added, not the total word count (thus not paying for those original words twice). The points awarded for review should always be based on total word count at the time of review. If tomorrows word count is different because the author tweaked, the amount rewarded should appropriately follow suit.
I don't think title tweaks, authors notes, or changes to covers should be assessed any cost. Those are all mechanical necessities not falling under the perusal of the review.
Edited to add: would it be possible to add a box that tells us how much a tweak will cost, and how it will effect the reward amount for review?
Ditto to Janet's, Linda's, Don's, njc' sand K's comments.
Also, Sol, please let me know whether I'm getting credit for my review of fwc's script as requested earlier.
How about points assessed in a range? 0 to 500 = eight points, 501 to 1000 = sixteen points, etc. Why make this more complicated than it has to be? If I post a story at 499 points, I'm charged a fixed fee. If I edit it to 600, I'm charged the new fee.
Also, if some shyster is trying to scam the system, don't you have other means to target them, rather than punish the entire community?
Edit:
Wasn't one of the perks of being premium originally offered that you could have "unlimited" groups? Maybe I dreamed that...
We're going to remove the feature that recalculates points. I want to simplify the system, not make it more complex. If the site doesn't mind having people add tons of content and not paying more points to review, I don't have a problem with it.
Great, that makes sense, Sol.
I think the fairest way would be remember-the-max, but I won't argue too loudly. Remember, though, that some 'complexity' is unpredictability, which is why remembering and announcing the max would probably work well.
Now, a different question. When I've done six inline review items, I'm told that have now satisfied the requirements for the points payment. I don't know if the number depends on the size of what I'm reviewing, or whether what I put in the 'final' box will count towards my minimum. What if I want to call out two grammar oddities or one oddity and a hapex, and then bare my curmudeonly soul down below? Can I still earn review credit?
We're going to remove the feature that recalculates points. I want to simplify the system, not make it more complex. If the site doesn't mind having people add tons of content and not paying more points to review, I don't have a problem with it.
Hi Sol,
I think this is a good solution. I never noticed anyone adding tons of content after an initial publish. If this did occur, I suspect it was only a few individuals. Occasionally, I added a few paragraphs or so, but I think this is fair as the process of workshopping evolves. I think most of us are members to give and get feedback of stories in progress. Letting us make minor edits as we go to avoid duplicated reviews is extremely helpful.
Cheers,
Don
TheNextBigWriter Premium → Question about new points charges for edits
