roguery, sir!

I have it on good authority Sting is the name of Bilbo's [THIS IS MY WORD]

(Currently reading.) smile

bee pollen

nimbly she flies from petal to vine

rave at close of day

Bonne nuit wink

haut-le-cœur

Chaplin

Box(ers)

hinder

jolly roger

Happy birthday! x

corra wrote:

Beginning this today:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/6b/Journal-of-a-novel_cover-small.jpg/220px-Journal-of-a-novel_cover-small.jpg

I enjoyed his sprawling novel East of Eden, so I thought it'd be interesting to see his thoughts in progress while he was writing the first draft. Apparently he would warm up to his writing each day by writing his editor writing updates. So we get the inside scoop on the process. I hope he loathed his work and had no idea what he was doing. It would make me feel better. smile

Finished this one. I LOVED it. He was human. Even with a Pulitzer under his belt, he dealt with all the "what am I even writing, is this becoming dull" problems of a writer. He just kept going. He stuck to a schedule. He knew the doubts would come; he expected them, and expected to consider the book the worst thing he'd ever written MANY times before finishing. He didn't let all that beat him. He just waited it out, and kept trying while he waited. Quite inspiring!

Raggedy Andy

novel

Penguin

Beginning this today:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/6b/Journal-of-a-novel_cover-small.jpg/220px-Journal-of-a-novel_cover-small.jpg

I enjoyed his sprawling novel East of Eden, so I thought it'd be interesting to see his thoughts in progress while he was writing the first draft. Apparently he would warm up to his writing each day by writing his editor writing updates. So we get the inside scoop on the process. I hope he loathed his work and had no idea what he was doing. It would make me feel better. smile

Yes, saw the smile. smile THE SMILE OF ME WINNING THE ARGUMENT. lol

wheat (penny)

Interesting quote. Thanks for sharing.

I will definitely tell you what I think of Shane. I'll actually probably like it. Ma described it to me and says it's good. I find the trailer I watched nauseating and awful. She says the trailer is not a good reflection of the movie. She's going to watch it with me one of these days when I have the time.

I was mostly messing with you, Vern. My point wasn't that you should cite other people who say it's the best. Unless they can tell me why they hold that opinion (by assessing the work itself), I don't care what they say. 

I didn't ask for "substantial proof outside" you and me? At least I don't think I did? The only time I mentioned proof was when I suggested that you offered no proof that Shane couldn't have been imagined without Tombstone. My proof was the fact that Tombstone actually happened LONG before Shane was a glint in somebody's eye, so I wanted to know more on that point: why do you say Tombstone wouldn't have existed without Shane, as in, what was your proof? From the actual film. In your own words. As in, why do you make that claim? I certainly didn't mean by that that you should quote someone beyond yourself. That's not proof. I could easily find a source to back up my own opinion and it would be meaningless without actual analysis of the film. I want to know what you think, and why, based upon your own expertise and an analysis of Shane alongside Tombstone. As in, why is one superior? Why do you say that Shane made Tombstone possible? A proper answer might have convinced me.

But I didn't expect you to actually do it. No one has time for that! I certainly don't, and intend not to bother with it myself. Ha! Tombstone isn't even really my favorite. I just pulled that one out to annoy you by disagreeing. I think it's good, but Buffalo Girls with Melanie Griffith and Angelica Houston is my actual favorite. I wouldn't say it's the best. I haven't watched everything western and can't make such an all-encompassing argument.

I think you can debate art and develop something more substantial than flat opinion. Yes, ultimately, it's opinion, but you can back yourself up with a sound argument and take your position beyond opinion to whatever it is that art inspires -- intelligent discussion, sound analysis. Sound analysis is not quoting other people or relying upon your age as proof that you are right. That's a flippy argument, sir, and I will never buy that. Nor would anyone sensible. Which is why I began poking at you. I was thinking, "Re-he-he-he-heally, then"? when you started defending your position by minimizing mine. Not a good plan if you want to win. I probably would have been convinced by a sound defense of the film itself. I've never seen it, so you could have only told me the good parts and I'd have bowed to your greatness. Too late now! lol

(I am still teasing you. Grin on my face, and such. Not easy to see online, so I thought I should say so! My uncle and I do this all the time at the dining room table. He often hauls out the "I am older and know more" empty argument as proof of things, to his detriment.)

Buffalo

vern wrote:

He walks into the sunset.

Well said! lol

I'm not convinced by your argument. The fact that a bunch of people who write westerns voted for their top ten favorites is still just opinion. They haven't said why they claim Shane as a favorite in this article -- only (it seems) that they personally prefer it, which is still ultimately an opinion. If what you mean to argue is that Shane is your favorite, that's a valid argument and we shake hands. Telling me that it is the best is negotiable and you haven't yet convinced me... or, it seems, the president of the group of writers you cite.

My mother used to watch westerns all the time with her brother and dad. The old kind, like Shane. She's seen A TON of them. She says Shane is good and I should watch it, and Tombstone is also good, but the greatest Western of all time is How the West Was Won. She then reminded me that I exist because of her. I find that to be an impenetrable argument.

vern wrote:

Ahh, but you haven't lived long enough to have experienced a valid sample size. I, on the other hand, have seen both the "contenders" and can say with complete unvarnished truth that "Tombstone" wouldn't even have been imagined without the previous fame of "Shane", yeah, not even a trailer, lol. Take care. Vern

I don't consider this a valid argument. I could be ten years old and still have seen as many westerns as you have. They're right out there for the watching. It's not like they disappeared into the ether as soon as they were filmed. Second, you offer no proof that Tombstone wouldn't have been imagined without Shane beyond the fact that you have seen both and can therefore speak as an expert. Meanwhile, if you open up your history book and look up Tombstone you'll find an entry on the topic predating Shane by a good seventy years. You may put that in your pipe, sir, and smoke it. smile

http://i.imgur.com/RZ3Z8a7.gif

The best western of all time is Tombstone.

http://i.imgur.com/QfN3uKF.gif

(Pardon the sloppy run-on writing. I'm supposed to be writing a paper and snuck* in to share.) smile

* snuck! Ha!

I just completed A Hobbit, a Wardrobe, and a Great War: How J.R.R. Tolkien and C.S. Lewis Rediscovered Faith, Friendship, and Heroism in the Cataclysm of 1914-18.

https://images.gr-assets.com/books/1435974364l/23647114.jpg

Pretty interesting. There's a lot in it about the popular/literary response to Christianity coming out of the war (extreme skepticism), which offers some context on works by Lewis and Tolkien. The author doesn't make the claim that Lord of the Rings was inspired by the war. Only that the experience, as well as what happened in the world after WWI (such as the spread of Fascism) provides historical context for the work. Of the war itself, the only bit that suggests the books bore any reflection of the war is a letter by C.S. Lewis to Tolkien when the first book in the trilogy was published, saying (paraphrased) now what we went through will live on. Lewis and Tolkien were extremely close friends, and encouraged one another in their work. The author of this book speculates that each of them were writing of the complexities of the human psychology, and the possibility for nobility beyond those complexities.

Apparently Tolkien wouldn't have kept going, but for Lewis, who read his drafts relentlessly, and kept at him for years until he finished. Likewise, Tolkien was there for Lewis, putting in a word to get his work published, encouraging him along the way. I was actually more interested in their story of friendship than the parts about their books. However, I confess this did inspire interest in Tolkien's work. For the first time ever.