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vern wrote:
njc wrote:

It seems to pick random words instead of using the input I gave it.

I think you have to sign up to put in your own stuff. I didn't see any place to do input. If you hit the "Explore" link then it brings up random items to diagram. If you click the "Learn more" link then it wants you to sign up, but still doesn't provide a means to insert your own items to explore. At least that's the way it worked for me. Take care. Vern

It opens with a random word. Then you put any word in. I haven’t signed up for anything. I have used it lots.  Works great.  In fact, I am not aware that there is anything to sign up for.  It’s never asked me, and I don’t even see an option in the menu to “sign up” other than following on Twitter.  I do use it only on mobile devices.  Never tried it on a normal computer.

Interesting tool for word-nerds ...

https://visuwords.com

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Marilyn Johnson wrote:

For anyone besides myself who is in the path of this monster, stay safe!  I'm in the northeastern corner of Georgia, one mile from the SC state line at Anderson.  We're on high alert and waiting to see which way it turns.  Our governor has declared Georgia in a state of emergency.  I'm on the downside of the dam at Hartwell Lake, which is a manmade lake with 1000 miles of shoreline.  Here's hoping the floodgates open on time because we're scheduled for some massive rain in our area and high winds!  Not really a good time to live in the forest as I do!!   

Fingers and toes crossed on this one!

MJ

I was in the middle of this one yesterday from 10:00am to 5:00pm in Shenzhen/Hong Kong.  Typhoon Mangkhut (Force 10 (equivalent to Hurricane  Category 5)).  I’ve been in the middle of over two dozen hurricanes in the last twenty-two years - never one like this ...
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ty … 32ebf9186b

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Marilyn Johnson wrote:
Seabrass wrote:

Are you a good swimmer?

Prime example of why I rescue 4-legged asses instead of 2-legged ones.

Yo, Seabrass ...
https://media.giphy.com/media/VIGzqblXygkE0/giphy.gif

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Seabrass wrote:

Are you a good swimmer?

Seriously?

Thanks for the info.  But I’m really hoping for feedback specifically on the questions I posed — regarding those publications and that website.

I’m in the market for an agent.  I have collected a good deal of info on this, and I’m curious if anyone has opinions yea or nay on the Writer’s Market as a resource for agents, specifically the “Guide to Literary Agents” resource
https://www.writersdigestshop.com/guide … book-r8472

... and the accompanying literary agent content on http://www.writersmarket.com


Also, does anyone have any feedback on the Writer’s Market publication https://www.writersdigestshop.com/write … ition-2019

...or the online subscription to http://www.writersmarket.com

Thanks.

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njc wrote:

BriefCatch providesfive quantitative measures of writing quality.  To collapse these measures, this post uses the average (mean) as the focal variable.

BriefCatch’s scores run from zero to 100 for the five measures, which are Flow, Plain English, Punchiness, Reading Happiness and Sentence Length.

Who could have guessed “reading happiness” could be measured?  Definitely gonna run my next brief to the Supreme Court through this puppy.   I mean, who would want their amicus to fail to warm the cockles of Clarence Thomas’s heart?
Clarence Thomas

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Dirk B. wrote:

Temple, where do you sign up for their blog/posts? I can't find a field to submit my email address.

Thanks.
Dirk

I think I got on it when I tried the free trial some time back (no credit card required).  https://www.autocrit.com/book-editor-free-trial/

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Just a point of clarification on this.  This wasn’t intended to pitch AutoCrit.  I think it’s a waste of money for most people.   I subscribe to their blog because it sometimes has some good articles.  I have tried it and found it too “mechanical” (and kind of silly in many cases).  Great writing (and great grammar/punctuation) is an “art,” not a manufacturing process employing interchangeable widgets.  I don’t use it or advocate it.  I have tested (out of curiosity) all of these kinds of applications—as I do believe, some day, they will evolve to be more useful.  I found them all wanting (so far).

My two cents (or more) in advance of being clobbered (and this is not just in reference AutoCrit, but all applications that purport to assist editing):

(PS and before I begin: yeah, yeah, yeah ... opinions are like a—holes, everybody’s got one. I’m an a—hole, here’s my opinion ...)

1. For the novice, it’s too often used as a crutch to support struggling writers too lazy to learn grammar and punctuation rules.  For people who use it that way, it will probably marginally help some of their writing (until they give up, because they will, inevitably), but without a solid grounding in grammar and punctuation, they won’t be able to effectively use what they get from it.  If you are lazy, then you won’t solve that problem with a crutch.  In fact, for these people, in the main, it does more harm than good, as if you don’t have the will (or gumption, it should be noted) to interpret the info, you end up just being a non-learning robot and repeating bad practices (and not even knowing it), and you never develop the ear for language, which is at the heart of being a skilled writer.  Tragically, it tends to create tedious know-it-alls who ... well, don’t.  Alas: lazy folks end up giving up these kinds of applications in the end, because even a crutch requires too much effort for the truly lazy.

2. For novice writers who use it as an active assist to help them learn punctuation and grammar, and who are disciplined enough to strive to understand the “why” instead of just blindly doing what it recommends, they might get some benefit out of it.  But voraciously reading and actively studying grammar/punctuation would be time better spent—and much more fun and effective.

3.  For experienced, non-lazy writers with a good grasp of punctuation and grammar: taken with a grain of salt (and used intelligently and judiciously), it can be a second set of eyes if you don’t have good beta readers and have money to blow.

4.  Bottom line, if you want a solution to weak grammar and/or punctuation, there is no shortcut or magic wand: 1) there are some great reference books out there to be read and absorbed - read them; absorb them; 2) read (read, read, read) with an aim to understanding why skilled writers make the choices they do and to develop your ear for language; 3) read the work of  good editors and try to understand why they make the suggestions they do; 4) try to edit the work of others to hone your skills; 5) seriously consider the suggestions others make about your work and try to understand why before you take or reject; 6) read your work aloud to get an “ear” for language (and good grammar and punctuation); 7) if you are lazy, just stop now and don’t drive yourself batty; and, lastly, 8) bow to Pablo Picasso for this piece of wisdom:

“Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.”

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vern wrote:

I would boil it down to, "If you ain't looking for criticism (that means pro and con) then you probably shouldn't be asking for reviews by publishing on a reviewing oriented site. " And if you're overly sensitive, you might want to bathe in salt water for a while to toughen the skin -- and before I get pelted with rotten tomatoes, no, that doesn't give license to rude behavior. Just my take. Take care. Vern

... aka what to do if you’re looking for wind up your skirt ...
PunBB bbcode test

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I found this insightful ...

From the AutoCrit Blog
https://www.autocrit.com/blog/2018/09/0 … sm-writer/

How to Handle Criticism
There’s an art to dealing with criticism, and it goes beyond smiling gamely and saying, “Thanks for giving it to me straight!” while secretly dying inside. Here are some ways to make the process less painful and more productive.

• Realize that others want to help. Sure, some critics are smug and think they know best, but generally, people who take the time to give you feedback want to help you grow as a writer. Remind yourself that most people have good intentions … even those who are less-than-tactful.

• Separate yourself from your manuscript. You’ve spent hours with your manuscript, alone in your writing cave. It can begin to feel as though you and your draft are one and the same. Feedback on your writing isn’t personal. “I don’t like this paragraph” doesn’t equate to “I don’t like you.”

• Remember to TWYWLTR. It stands for “Take What You Want; Leave The Rest.” Not every bit of criticism offered is going to resonate with you, and that’s okay. Give all of the feedback you receive your consideration, but in the end, keep only what resonates. You can’t please everyone. And sometimes critics are wrong. But …

• Don’t be closed-minded. Before you decide that a critic is wrong, make sure you’ve taken the time to consider whether she might be right. This is especially true when more than one person gives you the same feedback. If three beta readers all say they don’t understand your character’s motives, then you probably have some work to do.

I found this interesting, funny, poignant...had me nodding a lot.  Maybe you’ll like it to.

http://writerunboxed.com/2018/09/03/25- … f-writing/
25 Truths About the Work of Writing
September 3, 2018 By Greer Macallister

1. Writing is the easiest work you’ll ever do, more joy than labor, a flurry of words pouring from your fingers onto the page so beautifully and smoothly you’re more witness than worker. Some days.
2. On other days, it’s so hard and slow and yes, laborious, that you feel you must be doing it wrong because if it’s this hard how could anyone possibly force themselves to do it?
3. You will be surprised one day, many months after you’ve written something and circled back to it, when you can’t tell the words you wrote in mood #1 from the words you wrote in mood #2.
4. You will want to quit.
5. You will almost certainly quit at least once.
6. You will start again when it has become obvious to you that quitting isn’t working out.
7. It’s work and it’s magic and it’s a mad alchemy.
8. You’ll learn just as much from other people’s work as you do from your own.
9. People who aren’t writers themselves probably will not understand what it’s like for you when the work is going poorly. They may sympathize, they may comfort you, and thank goodness for that, but still, they won’t truly understand.
10. The work you do is yours in a primal and important way, but that doesn’t mean that it won’t be better if you work with other people. You owe it to yourself to try.
11. No work is ever wasted. Even if you delete thousands of words from a draft, you are a different and better writer because you wrote them.
12. Effort doesn’t show. Never keep a scene or a character or even a book because you say to yourself, But I worked so hard on it. (See also #3 and #11.)
13. “I worked so hard on it” also doesn’t get you an agent.
14. Or a publisher.
15. Or readers.
16. Everyone works differently. You don’t have to write every day or write what you know or stick to any other particular process that happens to work for other people. Even if it works for a lot of other people. All that matters is whether it works for you.
17. Like those writers who type out novels on their iPhones with one hand while commuting to their day jobs on the subway? Awesome. That’s fantastic. But it doesn’t mean you’re any less of a writer if you don’t work the way they do.
18. And don’t judge other writers for how they work. It should go without saying, but alas, sometimes it has to be said.
19. You don’t have to be producing words to be working. Thinking, observing, planning, all these are important parts of the writing process. It’s not all about word count.
20. Work matters. Luck matters. Timing matters. Intangible, uncontrollable factors matter. That’s the writer’s lot.
21. The moment at which you finish the work is the moment at which you are least qualified to evaluate whether it’s any good.
22. How you feel about the work of writing will change over time because you change over time. Don’t be afraid to change your process or your goals. Something that worked for you 10 years ago may not work anymore. Explore.
23. A writer at work tends to stay at work. Keep your characters on your mind every day and you’re more likely to find yourself back at the keyboard bringing them to life more often.
24. Don’t let anyone make you feel bad for wanting to get paid for your work. It is work, after all.
25. If you’re lucky, one day a review will refer to your style of writing as “effortless,” and you will laugh and laugh and laugh.

I liked 12.  Reminded me of a favorite quote:
“Don’t cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it”
-unknown

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Mark S. Moore wrote:

In writing, does it work to say poverty claimed someone's life? Do you need to get more specific and talk about hunger or lack of shelter? Disease? Is it more or less poignant?

I'm trying to talk about parents who died from a combination of poor diet and lacking shelter.

You can’t “die of poverty,” per se.  You can certainly die from the “effects of poverty.”

You can die of starvation or diseases that attack the chronically malnourished, but you can’t “die from lack of shelter” per se.  Lack of shelter exposes you to conditions that could kill, such as cold, lightning strike flooding, heat, disease, animal attack, ad infinitum—but in those cases, the “lack of shelter” is merely a contributing factor, so indirect. 

I’d be specific about what caused the death if merely for precision.

With respect to poignancy, most anything can be rendered poignant if you have the writing skill to evoke pity from the reader.  That, of course, begins by having created characters the reader cares about.  But by the same token, the most poignant situation won’t be so if you don’t have the writing chops to make it so.

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vern wrote:

I see nothing wrong with "climb down/up" per se as it can denote a direction much like the points of a compass, but if the phrase draws attention from the author, one could restate the situation to avoid it entirely. Take the staircase example: "With his advanced arthritis, tackling the rickety staircase wouldn't be a walk in the proverbial park. Nonetheless, once he managed the journey, his old bones didn't squeak as much as those damn steps." Or such depending on context. There's always another means to the end. Take care. Vern

LOL

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Marilyn Johnson wrote:

Climb = ascend; go up. 

Therefore, is 'climb down' an oxymoron?  I've never been comfortable using 'climb down' in a sentence, so what's your opinion?  If you feel the same, what do you say instead?  Just curious.

Climb has many meanings.  One is:
to proceed or move by using the hands and feet, especially on an elevated place; crawl: to climb along a branch; to climb around on the roof.

“Climb down” has always been legitimate when used properly, and it is almost always listed as a verb phrase in  “climb” entries in the dictionary.

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Mark S. Moore wrote:

Hi All,

I'm looking for suggestions for professional editors people have used. I'm looking for a copy edit or a line edit. Currently, I'm looking at using Bookbaby but I'd love to get some other suggestions either of individuals or services.

https://reedsy.com

I am working on a personal fiction writing/editing “Style Sheet”

Does anyone use a Style Sheet format/template they are happy with?  If so, can you give me a link, please?   I am also interested in comprehensive Style Sheet checklists.  I have searched online and have found a few, but still not satisfied—just curious if anyone has anything they like.

Beth at the Editor’s Blog has a decent checklist (see below), but she’s a bit too old school for my tastes.  My real interest is in having a really good template in a WP or SS format.

Thanks.

PS:  For anyone who doesn’t know what a Style Sheet is:
http://theeditorsblog.net/2011/07/12/st … -benefits/

Dirk B. wrote:

I've pointed this problem out before, but it has yet to be fixed. There are formatting bugs in the Content and Chapter Summaries. I write a well-formatted summary that's structured and easy to read, and it gets clobbered by the formatting bug (random line breaks and html tags). This seems like it ought to be an easy fix, unless there is some unknown purpose to this behavior. It makes the site's main feature, the inlines, look sloppy the moment you click to read a chapter. I think it would make a better first impression for new users if the inlines looked solid.

Thanks
Dirk

You could send a note to Sol and ask about this.

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j p lundstrom wrote:

Good one, Temple!

The article does offer some useful suggestions. My pet peeve is related to the two about too much description of the setting and giving the character's height. That is detailed description  of a character's clothing, hairstyle and makeup. Unless it has a direct bearing on the plot, forget it. Give the reader a chance to visualize the character.

We have all gone through phases of overuse or misuse of punctuation. It's part of the learning process. (I wrestle with the semicolon, em dash and period, too.) For that reason, we should all learn to accept criticism with grace, even though we may wish to give in to feelings of hurt and anger. It does no good to offer protestations of artistic freedom. If It's wrong, it's wrong.

The good thing is once you get it right, your work is better, easier tor read, and more widely accepted. And isn't that what we want?

I generally agree, for novice writers (like me), having the discipline and the good sense to delve deeply into the rules and embrace them as we learn is crucial.  The same thing can be said for any craft.  Too many of us begin ignoring them before we understand them fully.  Then (usually out of laziness, ignorance, or just not giving a crap about the craft) we use some reference to an accomplished writer to justify our (usually) less-informed rule-eschewing.  In reality, great writers are usually very knowledgeable about the “rules” they break (as pedantic editors pull their hair out), unlike us mere mortals.

This is a good and timely article on the topic:
https://www.readitforward.com/authors/j … de-syntax/

Yet there is hope.  For those writers who aim for something beyond mediocrity, to those of us who dedicate our lives to it every day, I offer this ...

“Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.”
-Pablo Picasso

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“semi-colon” is almost a full length of intestine.  “semicolon” is a punctuation mark.

*facepalm* LOL

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vern wrote:

I'm forever getting called out on semi-colons. I have cut down, but still use them probably more than I should. They just look so cute, lol. Take care. Vern

LOL.  Curse the naysayers.   I like semicolons too; they help me direct the length of a pause in phrasing, like music.

“Punctuation tells the reader how to hear your writing. That’s what it’s for.”
-Ursula K. Le Guin

PS: But, Vern, if they’re “so cute” is your excuse for using them, what’s the justification for the superfluous hyphen?  ;-)

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Marilyn Johnson wrote:

Thought some of us may find this helpful.
http://www.writersdigest.com/revision-s … -narrative

This is good.  Thanks.

Seabrass wrote:

Is the part that 'blazes' the same part that 'twinkles'? Maybe it's the upper eyelids that blaze and the lower eyelids that twinkle. Or the left eye can blaze furiously in wrath and the right eye twinkles in mischievous mirth- but only on Sundays and Tuesdays (in winter). When the eyes blaze, can a character look about, or does the blazing singe too many eyebrows and eyelashes? Do the nostrils flare? And what do them lip things do? (Character's probably eating, so they're kinda stuck keeping food and drool in place.)  Nothing captures emotions like eyebrows scrunching though, whether it's in consternation or vexation or mere puzzlement- wait, don't they rise in puzzlement? Or is that befuddlement? (Right now one of my own is scrunched while the other is raised very Spock-like as I puzzle my way through my vexing consternation.) And let's avoid talk of whether the forehead is furrowing or other wrinkles are crinkling- that's just going overboard.

Too bad them white globes can't change color. Then the eyeballs themselves can become completely expressive. Wait, we're authors! Who says them white eyeball globes (otherwise known as sclera) can't change from unexpressive (inexpressive?) white to blushing pink to enigmatic purple to blazing red or twinkling green? Them eyes can already blaze and twinkle and who knows what else! Nothing like color-coding to let the other character(s) noticing them blazing or twinkling eyes know exactly what's going on. (Hopefully we're not in first-person POV when the POV character's eyes blaze and twinkle, unless there's a mirror conveniently nearby.)

Too bad we don't have gills on our necks. I imagine they'd be able to flap furiously or purse themselves disapprovingly. Wait! We're authors...

I don’t think you’re supposed to drink the bong water...

Dirk B. wrote:

One of my best reviewers has a thing against expressing emotions or thoughts just by the look of the eyes (e.g., his eyes blazed with fury, his eyes twinkled with mirth, etc.). I've seen this done in multiple books and I l like it. My reviewer considers it lazy and stupid. He's trying to break me of the habit and is starting to wear me down, even though I really like it. My take on it is that readers know it's the whole face that expresses these things. The eyes just happen to be the focal point.

Thoughts?
Dirk

Eyes themselves are completely incapable of expressing emotion, or even creating a certain “look.”  The area around the eyes, however, is central to human expression.  And tears, of course, express emotion, though that’s an action of ducts, not eyes.  That said, your examples are problematic.  “His eyes blazed” is sufficient (though I wouldn’t use this).  If you feel you need to explain an expression (“with fury”), then you should have another go at it.  Same thing with the redundant element “with mirth” in the second example. 

Bottom line, the eyes (in the broader sense, inclusive of the area around them) are “obviously” capable of expressing emotions.