Re: Titles in The Pendragon and The Beast of Caer Baddan
A kimg like Milwr is happy ruling a land that NEEDS his peculiar, amoral skills, and will leave the kingdom in the hands of the only ones who can rule it--the amoral among his heirs.
Fantasy/Magic & Sci-Fi → Titles in The Pendragon and The Beast of Caer Baddan
A kimg like Milwr is happy ruling a land that NEEDS his peculiar, amoral skills, and will leave the kingdom in the hands of the only ones who can rule it--the amoral among his heirs.
I hadn't thought of putting Gratianna's son (or her living step son) in this book. (Gratianna's son is rather bad but Drech eventually straightens him out.) Because Gratianna's son does not live at the convent with her nor travels with her, there doesn't seem to be a place to put him without adding a lot of stuff and changing a lot of stuff. I'm not sure I can justify that.
I had King Milwr mention him because it seemed a logical question.
"I don't want to do all this work and risk my men and then have YOUR son claim the throne." That sort of thing.
But knowing Milwr, he'd probably just kill Graitanna's son and not worry about it. So maybe I should just take the line out?
King Milwr is rather careful about appearances. He wants his family and his subjects (the people living in the Kingdom of Lerion) to think well of him. He had his knights lie about his whereabouts, but they did not actually see him murder Drech's father. (Drech mistakenly identifies Sir Gurci as being one of King Milwr's knights. Drech will eventually find out that this is not correct.) Thus King Milwr is a lot like a serial killer. He can hunt victims and yet take his sons to Little League and his daughter to ballet class. His older son, Riderch, has suspected that his father is "off", but until the end of Book III, never actually knew for certain. The younger son and the daughter really have no clue. They are in for a shock!
A kimg like Milwr is happy ruling a land that NEEDS his peculiar, amoral skills, and will leave the kingdom in the hands of the only ones who can rule it--the amoral among his heirs.
Oh, I hadn't thought of that!
But King Milwr is healthy and determined to live for a long time. He is in line to be the next the Pendragon after all (King Swale and Prince Camuir being out of the equation). With Mother Gratianna's help, King Milwr will take over the Kingdom Colun, kill Vitalinus, and subjugate those unruly Trinovantae. He is an Andoco and therefore better then everyone else, so he should conquer everyone else, rule everyone else. And yes, there are a lot of perks for being on the top.
These characters are walk-ons. You don't want them in drama because of its compressed form, but there is room for them in a novel. Naming a character isn't the same as bringing the character in. If the character has as much as action as a table, the character isn't present at all; the character is a piece of the setting.
Look at all the 'underused' characters in Girl Genius. Two characters who will probably never be seen again: Crispin and the cat-maid.
These characters are walk-ons. You don't want them in drama because of its compressed form, but there is room for them in a novel. Naming a character isn't the same as bringing the character in. If the character has as much as action as a table, the character isn't present at all; the character is a piece of the setting.
Look at all the 'underused' characters in Girl Genius. Two characters who will probably never be seen again: Crispin and the cat-maid.
Haha! I love that I idea! Characters are props that we move around for our bidding. Bwa.Ha.Ha.Ha.Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
In fact, here's a list of your underused characters
Outigern
Cadvan
Nynio
Anlach
BecumaAll 5 of these characters have crawled out of the woodwork and jumped into the spotlight, making real distinction for themselves. Sadly, they've run off somewhere and hidden themselves when they could be being really cool. Onnen is not like them... she's not interesting because she did anything distinctive, but rather because other characters discuss her. I'm not certain how to express this difference, but it's significant.
Wow! You have been keeping track!
Prince Outigern gets his in the next book (Book V)
Sir Cadvan and Sir Anlach will have a bit next book (Book V) and a lot more in the last book (Book VI)
Princess Becuma also gets a bit more (I think in Book V)
Lord Nynio gets a little this book (Book IV) and more in the last (Book VI).
Onnen also gets time in the next book (Book V) as does her and Camuir's son.
Hey Rebecca!
Regarding Judicious Hazel, chapter two, you should most definitely keep the boy. He's too damn adorable. Maybe add in a little more panicking on the mother's part, though? Or, if that's against her personality, possibly another female figure? Personally, I would either A) freak out, B) protest, or C) grip my husband's hand, cover my eyes, cry out when the arrow looses, or some other squeamish reaction.
-Elisheva
Thanks!
I can definitely amp up Queen Lang's reaction! She's an over protective mother when it comes to little Pappo, so I can make her protest a lot!
I can't speak to merging it with the next chapter until I see that next chapter, but I think you should leave open the possibility of taking the previous chapter through this double-thread climax and reworking all the chapter breaks.
Ok, I do like the double thread stuff! I used it a lot in the Beast of Caer Baddan but hadn't really had a go opportunity with the Pendragon until now.
I could cut off part of chapter 18 with Drech and move it to 19. It also has Orson being sick though, so I'll have to think about it.
The next chapter (20) is turning out to be short as well.
Then maybe merge 19 with 20, especially if the music swells and climaxes there? https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p … bzuk#t=723
Nice!
I guess I'll have to ask everyone when I post 20...
Nice!
Watch the whole thing!
Rebecca Vaughn wrote:Nice!
Watch the whole thing!
Nice!
My favorite is Telemann but Bach has a special place in my heart...
Question about chapter breaks for Pendragon VI Chapters 18, 19 and 20!
Chapter 18 is average (9 pages)
Chapter 19 very short (5 pages)
And Chapter 20 average (8 pages)
1)
I could make 19 and 20 one very long chapter (I think 13 pages, which is the longest I have)
2)
I could split the contents of 19 up between 18 and 20 (20 would of course become the new 19)
Chapter 18 would end at:
...
But hopefully I shall not regret this.
They shook their swords to remove the blood and returned the weapons to their sheaths. Then lifting the injured knight, they draped his arms over their shoulders and staggered back to the bushes.
###
And Chapter 19 would start at:
“Agh!”
The scream of agony bounced off the standing stones, resonating the circle with the sound of pain. King Milwr's body trembled and contorted, his limbs pulling in vain against the hemp binds. Beads of sweat dotted his face.
“Belunus!” he cried. “It hurts!”
...
Then would contain all of what is now chapter 20
3)
I could cut this part:
Though the trek was no difficult than before, the Drech's party was tired from the fight, and Orson gasped and coughed the whole way. When they stopped to rest, Drech eyed his mentor with growing concern.
“Breath, Lord,” Drech whispered.
“I am well,” Orson replied, but speaking on brought on another fit of coughing.
Drech shook his head in dismay. “Let us go back before the whole Eire army is on us.”
He scanned the tired knights, counting them to be sure of their number.
“What!” he gasped. “Who is missing?”
The knights look around themselves, perplexed.
“Sir Gurci!” Captain Samyl breathed. “Where is Sir Gurci?”
Drech looked around again for that knight but could not find him.
“He was struck with a war club, but he did not fall,” Sir Teuhant said.
“Tis not good,” Drech groaned. “I must go and find him.”
“Indeed,” Orson said, rising to his feet.
“Not you, Lord,” Drech said to his mentor. “You are too weak to fight again tonight. Go with the knights back to camp.”
Orson shook his sheep white head. “I shall not die this night, Drech.”
“And neither shall you fight. Captain Samyl–”
“I shall not leave your side, Dominus,” the Captain replied.
Drech looked at him for a moment before nodding his consent. “The rest of you, go back to back.”
The knights began to protest, but Drech held up a silencing hand.
“I cannot sneak up on the enemy trailed by thirteen men,” he said. “The fewer come, the more likely I am to succeed. You will all take Lord Orson and return to camp. Sir Elisedd.”
“Yea, Dominus,” the lone Saxon of their group replied.
“See that Orson gets back to his tent.”
“Yea.”
“You are treating me like a child?” Orson said, laughing then coughing.
“I am, Lord,” Drech replied.
With Captain Samyl at his side, he left for the rocky beach.
out of chapter 18 to make it shorter (8 pages) and add it to chapter 19 to make it longer (6 pages)
4)
I could just leave them as is.
Let me know any thoughts or other suggestions!
I would not cut. You've got a good story with good flow, and your prose is so spare that there's nothing to prune away. My choice would be to see if part of 18 could be moved back to 17, and then to join the bulk of 18 with 19. If that won't work, then let it be.
I have no issue with them as is now which isn't really helping, sorry.
NJC
Oops! Sorry! I didn't mean cut out of the story! I should have said "remove from chapter 18 and move to chapter 19 to make 19 longer." Which was one of you suggestions.
5) fight to the death
But seriously, it's just a first draft. Don't overthink pacing yet
Haha! Sometimes I think writing is like fighting!
There might be a confusion with people groups, so I wanted to clarify. Let me know if you have any questions!
Celtic People (Britannae/Eire/Gaulic)
Height: Tall
Framed: Small
Hair Color: Brunet/Redhead/Blond
Hair: Curly/Wavy/Straight
Eyes: Round
Eye Color: Brown/Green/Blue
Pale/Freckled
Face: Long/Round
Germanic People (Saxon/Angel/Frisian/Frank)
Height: Short/Medium
Framed: Large/Medium
Hair Color: Blond/Brunet
Hair: Straight/Wavy
Eyes: Round/Slit
Eye Color: Blue/Brown/Green
Tanned
Face: Square
Viking People (Dane/Jute/Norse)
Height: Tall
Framed: Large/Medium
Hair Color: Blond/Brunet/Redhead
Hair: Straight/Wavy
Eyes: Round/Slit
Eye Color: Blue/Green/Brown
Pale
Face: Square/Long
Roman/Latin
Height: Short/Medium
Framed: Medium
Hair Color: Brunet/Blond/Redhead
Hair: Wavy/Straight/Curly
Eyes: Round
Eye Color: Brown/Copper/Blue/Hazel
Olive
Face: Square/Long
Pictish
Height: Tall
Framed: Medium/Large
Hair Color: Black/Brunet
Hair: Straight
Eyes: Round eyes
Eye Color: Gray/Hazel
Medium Brown/Tanned
Face: Square
These are just generalizations of course, as there could always be exceptions.
A Celtic could be short (like Enhinti)
Large boned (like Owain from the Beast)
Or have black hair (like Drech)
And with all the mixing, a lot of people had characteristics of another people mixed in (like the Dobunni being darker skinned even though they are Britannae).
Also remember that the rich are more likely to be tall in any culture at this time, as they had better nutrition and better access to medical aid. So a Saxon Aetheling could be as tall as a Britannae Prince even if the Saxon commoners are much shorter than the Britannae ones.
Added one comment in the review to answer a question.
Rebecca, it's no secret I'm a big fan of your story and I'll give it a five-star review when it hits Amazon, but that doesn't mean I'm satisfied in every way. I was thinking of some things, and I think I see a weakness in what you might call framing. I'll start the explanation with some illustration.
Where seven sunken Englands
Lie buried one by one,
Why should one idle spade, I wonder,
Shake up the dust of thanes like thunder
To smoke and choke the sun?
:
Yet Alfred is no fairy tale;
His days as our days ran,
He also looked forth for an hour
On peopled plains and skies that lower,
From those few windows in the tower
That is the head of a man.
:
Before the gods that made the gods
Had seen their sunrise pass,
The White Horse of the White Horse Vale
Was cut out of the grass.
:
For the White Horse knew England
When there was none to know;
He saw the first oar break or bend,
He saw heaven fall and the world end,
O God, how long ago.
:
For the end of the world was long ago,
When the ends of the world waxed free,
When Rome was sunk in a waste of slaves,
And the sun drowned in the sea.
:
And there was death on the Emperor
And night upon the Pope:
And Alfred, hiding in deep grass,
Hardened his heart with hope.A sea-folk blinder than the sea
Broke all about his land,
But Alfred up against them bare
And gripped the ground and grasped the air,
Staggered, and strove to stand.
:
He broke them with a broken sword
A little towards the sea,
And for one hour of panting peace,
Ringed with a roar that would not cease,
With golden crown and girded fleece
Made laws under a tree.
These are selected verses from the first two chapters of The Ballad of the White Horse, said to be the last great epic poem in the English language. Leave aside that it is an amazing work, and consider that it deals with a figure of legend. And although it does not pretend to be an exact history (having other ambitions, made clear in Alfred's prophecy in the last chapter--also amazing writing, but not pertinent here) it has an extraordinary sense of place and time-out-of-time, given in 'His days as our days ran' and 'Before the gods that made the gods ...'.
It was the year of fire... the year of destruction... the year we took back what was ours. It was the year of rebirth... the year of great sadness... the year of pain... and the year of joy. It was a new age. It was the end of history. It was the year everything changed.
The year is 2261. The place: Babylon 5.
-- Lennier, Zack, G'Kar, Lyta, Vir, Marcus, Delenn, Londo, Franklin, Ivanova, Garibaldi, Sheridan
A very different work, a very different setting. But note that all of the abstract promises end with a specific time and place.
Okay, how does this apply to you? You've got a historical setting, and probably some pretty definite dates for a few points. But the modern reader, ignorant of any history he didn't live through--and probably of two thirds of that!--needs help of a different sort.
The books are yours, and this is just a suggestion, though I think it would help.
I envision a preface, prologue, or preamble something like this:
In the lands we call France ((name)) ruled ((dynasty)) // battled ((peoples)) for ... .
To the south, in Spain ... , while in the lands now called Italy ... .
Further north, in the lands now Germany ... .
In the far north, in Sweden ... , and far to the northeast, in the lands of the Rus ... .But in the west, across a stormy channel, in the Islands we call Britain, a young man was coming into his right as King.
Obviously, I'm ignorant of what places and names might go here, and the introduction for The Beast must be different. Note though that you don't have to give exact dates; you need only give a tapestry that sets a tone and evokes a world now forgotten, except in the dusty stacks of old libraries.
I hope this helps, even if all it does is set you thinking on a better course.
For a really superb example of this sort of preamble, see the first two pages of the first volume of Manchester's The Last Lion. (The last half-page, a breathtaking description, could be summarized as a want ad: Help Wanted: Messiah. Experience required. But it loses something in the condensation.)
NJC
I get what your saying, though I have no idea how I could incorporate it into the story. Long intros tend to get skipped, so I'd have to make something very short. I can definitely play with it and see what happens! I don't want people going into the story, feeling lost...
The year is 413, and the British Isles are rocked by piracy, invasion, and internal war. Romano-Celtic rulers desperately cling to their lands as...
Something like that?
I'd allow about 180 words, less than a page, painting a rough picture of the world. I ran in a lot of items, but I think four might do it. You don't need or want to go into any depth on any of them.
There's no point diving into Britain, since the story will take that over. Instead describe the neighborhood, as it were, and end by turning, with a one-sentence teaser, to Britain.
You might set the scene in a town by mentioning the church, the town hall, the country doctor's house, and the newspaper office above the drugstore. Ellery Queen does this for Wrightsville in some of the Wrightsville novels, and at some length. (I'm recalling, I think, =Double Double=, one of the 'return to ...' stories.) But this doesn't need the depth, because it's just creating a sense of the world.
Why not try lining up three or four summary items and seeing how it reads? Try for fifteen to 25 words each, between three and six proper nouns in each? You know the history, I don't.
Fantasy/Magic & Sci-Fi → Titles in The Pendragon and The Beast of Caer Baddan