Topic: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

I've just started reading Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier some days ago. It immediately called my attention that this book, which a best seller back in its times and even hit the big screen, starts with a no-no. It's starts with a dream! The first chapter is completely a dream!

It's easy to understand why you mustn't start with a dream. I found myself skipping paragraphs and looking for "action" as, being the narrative a dream, I knew it was not something really happening and thus it'll do no harm if I skipped it.

My observation is because it's interesting how a current no-no didn't seem to be so back in the 1930´s, and it didn't stop the story from turning into a bestseller and an Oscar-awarded movie in Hitchcock hands.

Have today's agents and publishers become too picky?

Kiss,

Gacela

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Yes! But those type rejections are basically an excuse for rejection. If you're not already a best seller or someone famous with a story, they really are looking for anything to put it in the slush pile. Many best sellers of yesteryear would probably not make it past a para or two before being rejected. Agents/editors are merely mortals and have no more insight into what will be a bestseller than the average fifth grader selected at random. Each agent/editor has their own tastes and biases and that is why many best sellers of modern times have been rejected more than most of us would be famous authors. Traditional publishing is a crap shoot if you don't know someone or have your own fool proof marketing plan to go along with your "wonderful" novel. Just my opinion of course based upon years of observations. Take care. Vern

3 (edited by dagnee 2017-08-30 00:16:10)

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Mariana Reuter wrote:

I've just started reading Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier some days ago. It immediately called my attention that this book, which a best seller back in its times and even hit the big screen, starts with a no-no. It's starts with a dream! The first chapter is completely a dream!

It's easy to understand why you mustn't start with a dream. I found myself skipping paragraphs and looking for "action" as, being the narrative a dream, I knew it was not something really happening and thus it'll do no harm if I skipped it.

My observation is because it's interesting how a current no-no didn't seem to be so back in the 1930´s, and it didn't stop the story from turning into a bestseller and an Oscar-awarded movie in Hitchcock hands.

Have today's agents and publishers become too picky?

Kiss,

Gacela

Gacela...There are a lot of clues in that first chapter that set up the rest of the book. As the reader will find out, everything that happens in the book started and ended at the De Winter's huge estate. But why dream about it? Why not write, I went to Manderley? Because Manderley was burnt to the ground at the end of the novel. The main character can't go back. She can only dream of the first time she saw the mansion that was to become her home, and where all the conflict in the novel began and ended.

Why a dream then? I believe dreaming of her former home tells the reader she's remembering, and in a dream Manderley can be presented as mystical, overwhelming the character so much that years later it haunts her dreams.

That still doesn't answer why many authors choose dreams to begin their novels. I believe it is so the reader can form an instant connection with the character. We're all humans, most of us dream, and can relate to someone who dreams, whether it's a memory, or a nightmare.

Also, we don't know why we dream or where they come from. It's a common experience, dreams can influence our lives, rob us of sleep. But still, it's a relatable event in the character's life, and as writers are taught, to keep your reader interested you have to make the reader see something that they can grab on to and say to themselves, ‘That's happened to me.'

That being said, if you must start your novel with a dream, it should pertain to the rest of the novel and not a random thing.

smile

Movie trivia: The main character in the movie and the novel doesn't have a first name, she's always referred to as 'Mrs. D'Winter.' And in the movie you never see a picture of Rebecca.

4 (edited by Norm d'Plume 2017-08-30 00:06:17)

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Frank Herbert wrote Dune in 1965, the best-selling science fiction book of all time, in omniscient POV. He had to publish through Chilton Books, best known at the time for auto repair guides. Personally, I think most publishers don't have a clue when they have a hit on their hands. Harry Potter was rejected twelve times, yet J.K. Rowling is now the richest woman in England, second only to the Queen.

Here's an amazing list of famous rejection tales:
www.litrejections.com/best-sellers-initially-rejected

My 20-page prologue is probably going to send my book directly to the slush pile.

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

I dream of someday starting a book with a dream...

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

In your dreams, Charles. :-)

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

That's exactly what I said!

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

There's a big list of no-no's of publishing that have all been broken by authors who became best sellers. Whether a first chapter/page/paragraph/sentence/word is compelling is the most important point, regardless of rules. I can't read past the first paragraph of Rebecca without finishing the whole book because I find her style of writing so captivating. I read it all in one sitting for the first time at fourteen and it's been one of my favourites ever since - even if it breaks the dream rule!
At the same time, having friends in high places probably helped du maurier - Hitchcock called her his muse! He made movies out of her birds and Jamaica Inn as well as Rebecca!

9 (edited by corra 2017-08-30 13:02:11)

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Norm d'Plume wrote:

Here's an amazing list of famous rejection tales:
www.litrejections.com/best-sellers-initially-rejected.

"Margaret Mitchell gets 38 rejections from publishers before finding one to publish her novel Gone With The Wind. It sells 30 million copies."

I don't know about the rest of the books on this list, but the one about Gone with the Wind is completely untrue.

Margaret Mitchell never submitted Gone with the Wind officially. She certainly never submitted it 38 times, and she was never rejected for it. She spontaneously presented it to an editor who had spent a couple days with her BEGGING her for a look at a novel she claimed {and had been claiming for years} she wasn't writing. If he hadn't been so persistent, and a friend hadn't made the mistake of daring her, we probably wouldn't have Gone with the Wind.

She had written most of it several years earlier {1926-1929} because she'd injured her ankle and had nothing to do while housebound. Accustomed to a fast-paced life as a reporter in Atlanta, she was suddenly reduced to sitting around all day staring at the walls. She tried reading, but eventually that bored her, and since she enjoyed writing, she decided to take on a novel. Before she finished the project, life overwhelmed her. She'd long since given it up as "lousy" {though she privately worked on it sporadically, too shy with it to truly believe it would ever be ready for publication} when Harold Latham of MacMillan Publishing Company came through Atlanta in the 1930s. He was on the hunt for a new Southern writer, & having received a tip from a mutual acquaintance that she was writing something and could write well, he set his sights on Mitchell. She was spending the day with him showing him around Atlanta as a favor for a writing friend. She told him repeatedly that day she had no novel, adamantly changing the topic whenever he brought it up. She met him again the following day at a luncheon, and again rejected his repeated questions about her novel. By now he'd spoken enough to her, and heard enough about her, to be truly intrigued.

That night, a writing acquaintance {who had often benefited from Mitchell's research and suggestions when it came to her own novel} commented that it was remarkable Mr. Latham had thought Margaret could write a whole book, for Mitchell didn't take life seriously enough to accomplish such a feat. Mitchell was driving at the time, having spent the last couple days ferrying Mr. Latham as well as several writing friends, who hoped to sell their work to him, all over Atlanta. She had to stop the car when she began laughing. Furious by the taunt {for she despised not be taken seriously}, she stormed home and scoured her apartment, collecting the frayed manila envelopes containing long-forgotten chapters from Gone with the Wind, which she had stuffed everywhere in prior years as she randomly wrote: in the bathroom, under the sofa, in the closet. Each envelope contained multiple chapter revisions. They were all out of order, and since she had written the scenes spontaneously over a period of years, she had no idea which chapters had been completed anymore, and which hadn't. She'd never written the opening of the book, and some chapters failed to tie together important details in the story. All of it was in her head, and it had been so long since she'd written it she could no longer remember where it was incomplete.

She presented this stack, wholly out of order, to an astonished Harold Latham as he was leaving his hotel for the train. She later recalled that she was "hatless, hair flying, dirt all over my face and arms and, worse luck, my hastily rolled up stocking coming down about my ankles" {Walker, 197}. The stack was as tall as she was. As she progressed through the lobby, she had to stop several times to retrieve random chapters that leapt from the pile. He was, she claimed, able to keep a straight face. She told him to just take it for goodness sake, before she changed her mind. He began to read from a random chapter on the train, and when she telegraphed just hours later begging to retract her impulsive submission, he begged her to let him refuse, claiming he was already hooked.

That is how Gone with the Wind was published. She submitted it once, on impulse, in the most unprofessional way imaginable, & it was snapped up immediately.

Sources:
Gone with the Wind Letters by Margaret Mitchell – posthumous (1976)
Letters From Margaret (ed. Julian Granberry) – 2001
Southern Daughter: The Life of Margaret Mitchell by Darden Asbury Pyron (1991)
Margaret Mitchell and John Marsh: The Love Story Behind Gone With the Wind by Marianne Walker (1993)
Margaret Mitchell’s Gone With the Wind: A Bestseller’s Odyssey by Ellen F. Brown and John Wiley, Jr. (2011)

10 (edited by corra 2017-08-30 13:25:23)

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

My observation is because it's interesting how a current no-no didn't seem to be so back in the 1930´s, and it didn't stop the story from turning into a bestseller and an Oscar-awarded movie in Hitchcock hands.

I agree with dagnee: the opening points the finger to Manderley and suggests the narrator is so moved by whatever is about to happen at that estate as the tale unfolds, she cannot get away from it. So the opening isn't an unrelated dream: it's a lyrical, and HAUNTING, way to say that whatever is coming is IMPORTANT. If she was dreaming about a two-headed cat chasing her and then she popped awake to make her breakfast and decide whether she was having coffee or tea with her cereal, the dream opening would be the cliché "I don't know where to start this story so I'll start with her morning" blech that results in an auto-reject. Totally different when the dream relates to the story.

It isn't that beginning with a dream makes for an immediate bad story, necessarily; rather, beginning with a dream is a hint that the author lacks ingenuity. So if your writing is flat and you open with a dream -- bleh, auto-reject. This author lacks verve! However, if the dream is well-done, the suit might read on...

{Not to say I think anyone should open with a dream. Probably a gamble as a new writer!}

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Seabrass wrote:

I dream of someday starting a book with a dream...

I dream of someday starting a book

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

One of my favorite stories of all time begins with the line...

"This morning I dreamt of you."

But that's a recollection of a dream rather than an actual dream; so I suppose I'm okay to keep liking it?

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Rebecca's (Du Mauirier's, actually) style is really captivating the the story's mood is  intriguing. I have read about 25% of the story so far and it's a page turner, even if the pace is slow. Events unfold one by one at a time, but mystery is the ever-present element, fascinating the reader (by the way I'm reading it because Suin recommended it).

I wonder if you could begin with a dream that  foreshadows the story, thus interesting the reader. Gabriel García Marquez, Crónica de una muerte anunciada (Chronicle of a Death Foretold), begins with "On the day he was going to be killed, Santiago Nasar woke up at 5:30 in the morning to wait for the ship bringing the bishop. He had dreamt he ..." The first line gives away the whole story: "Hey guys, the MC will be killed by the end of the story. No further mystery, the chap will end up dead. Live with it."  And then he explains the dream, which of course further foreshadows the story, albeit fleetingly.

So, again, I wonder whether a dream foreshadowing the story is a good start. Not a summary, of course, but a sort of blurb, more complex than your regular blurb and not explicit (hope I'm explaining myself). Not that I'm planning to do so (my current WIP story starts with action and I won't change that) but, as an young author, I'd like to know. Who knows what is the next best-seller's strong start?

Kiss,

Gacela

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

I'm glad you're enjoying it - compared to the writers of today it is very slow-moving, but i feel that the description is so immersive that you really 'see' Manderlay and really feel the difficulties faced by Mrs. d'Winter and her awe of Rebecca. In the evenings, when she sits with Maxim by the fire with Jasper having tea, you can almost taste it!
Don't forget the resolution in the final installment of the awful & incredibly popular Twilight was a dream sequence too, where Alice showed everybody what would happen if they went into battle. Again, a dream was accepted by a publisher and published. It depends on how it's used.

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Dill Carver wrote:

"This morning I dreamt of you."

What's this from? I tried googling with no success...

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

Well, I've just finished Rebecca. Here are my impressions:

1. As I highlighted before, it starts with a dream, a big no-no nowadays. I can understand why it's a no-no. As a reader, I don't care about a dream. At least, not at this early stage of the story when I have no clue whether it's relevant or not. I read chapter 1 one again when I had finished the story, and THEN it made sense and turned mystical, but at first it didn't hit me.

2. The story is veeery slow paced. The underlying mystery kept me turning page after page, for I wanted to know. But we must recognise the pace is quite slow. It turns into a fast paced story after they discover Rebecca's sunken ship, and then I couldn't stop reading.

3. The second Mrs De Winter is annoying. I can understand she's under-educated, comes from a low class, has never been in charge of a household, is shy, but... stupid? It's okay that Mrs. Danvers scared the hell out of her, but that she never told Maxim that Favel had been there when foul play could be smelled a mile away, makes no sense (she heard Mrs. Danvers trying to prevent her learning Favel had been there). There are many times, littered here and there, when she makes the wrong decisions, making the reader (at least me) believe she must be stupid on top of all her other flaws.

4. The ending is unexpected and well done. When you think Maxim will be caught, you learn Rebecca didn't visit the doctor because she was pregnant, but because she suffered cancer. And then the house is on fire. Wow! I really enjoyed that part. It's interesting that, as a reader, you end up teaming-up with Maxim, who committed a crime, rather than seeking justice above all--even if Rebecca deserved being killed.

5. I would like that Mrs Danvers had been punished. Like the narrator, in the second chapter maybe, would have mentioned she felt pity for her because to die in a house on fire is horrible, just as it happened in the movie.

6. The above said, I think the story is quite good and would recommend anybody to read it if they can stand the second Mrs De Winters annoying stupidity.

Kiss,

Gacela

Re: Rebecca by Daphne du Maurier

I'm really glad you liked that book. I remember reading it for the first time - I'd gotten it as a present for my 14th birthday and read the whole thing in one sitting with The Beach soundtrack playing in the background. I've read it so many times since then and have always found the story to be so immersive that I struggle to put it down.

I have a lot of sympathy for the 2nd Mrs de Winter. She's an assistant to a bullying old woman when Maxim proposes, and because she lives in a time when class is very important, she constantly feels inferior. This isn't helped by Mrs Danvers always finding ways to put her down. Even the fact that she never shares her own name with the reader shows how insignificant she finds herself. Only towards the end does she start to grow in strength and realise that she does deserve Maxim & Manderlay.

I agree that a lot of her decisions are frustrating. For the majority of the book I much prefer the character of Rebecca, who has a stronger presence in the story than the 2nd Mrs.de Winter. But the story isn't really about her - it's more about Rebecca and Maxim.