1 Topic by jack the knife (edited by jack the knife 2014-11-17 19:13:36)

Topic: New change in point allocation/cost

To TMS members: Sol recently has reverted back to the old policy of allowing editing without costing more points to do so. That, I like. But he recommended that when new groups are started they have a no-points-required-to-post policy. If all groups adopt this, I see it leading to a free-for-all of postings and unbalanced vis a vis the reviewing side of the author's function. If it costs nothing to post, an author would need no points for reviewing, and such points would become worthless. Personally, I liked the old system, wherein one needed to review to accumulate points in order to use them to post. But what say you? Should we become a free group? Using the 60% rule they use in the Senate, I'll change the group to free if that is the group's decision.

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2 Reply by dagnee (edited by dagnee 2014-11-17 16:59:48)

Re: New change in point allocation/cost

I have a rule in my life, if it's complicated don't mess with it. What you describe is so complicated. When you say post do you mean your published work on the site will show up to be reviewed in groups? Or do you mean a post like the one I'm writing now? If it's the former then I would use a different word than post for clarification. I would use the word 'publish' or 'submission'. And if it's the later, why would anyone want to post in a forum if it cost points?

The language describing the problem is the problem here. At least for me.

Bottom line, I don't think blending the site and group forums was a good idea.

Also, with instant messaging and 'quickees' a person can post, edit, rewrite and repost and still receive feedback without the constraints of the review and/or it costing them anything except the price of the initial posting. Since Sol is doing away with the editing charges, a person could just publish a few sentences, costing him next to nothing, then go back and put in a full text for nothing.

The site got rid of the rating system because it could be rigged, which was imo good, making editing free is just another way to cheat the system.

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Re: New change in point allocation/cost

And if it's the later, why would anyone want to post in a forum if it cost points?

I think the issue is that groups are not really forums. Everyone who transferred over is thinking of them like because that's where they resides on the other site. But they are more like small sites. They have their own membership, their own content, their own message boards, etc. Everyone has come over from the previous site and so it is one community and everyone knows each other and is comfortable. Those that weren't were driven away or left on their own.  But in the future, many different types and levels of writers might join and interact and they may not all want to be part of the same experience.

Right now, if someone wants to be a part of this "community" they have to pay into the system to do it. For those that have already paid on the old site, this seems like a problem. And because the audiences pretty much the same, it is.

This doesn't make a solution easy though. I happen to think if you don't want people to pay extra to post in your group, make it "no points required." If you want them to have to pay into the group, not just the site, make it "points required." So, I guess that means I vote for keeping the current system.

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Re: New change in point allocation/cost

There is obviously a misunderstanding here. What I was pointing out was that to post a story into this group, it now costs points to do so. The easiest solution to avoid spending points would be to post the story in the Free TNBW group. But then the advantage of posting in your genre, and thus making it easier for people to find your posting, would be lost. I'm a thriller writer, so if I'm looking for a new thriller posting, I would come to this group. As an example, Janet Taylor-Perry is a member of this group, but she posted her latest story in the TNBW Free group, with thousands of members. Someone who doesn't know her would have to stumble upon the posting by accident.

So I don't think it's complicated, Dags. You've posted in this group. Right now it will cost you points to do so. But if we make our group free, it won't, and you'll still have the advantage of having your story in the appropriate genre group.

Cobber, there's no "extra" points required to post into this group. It costs the same no matter what points-required group you post into. And posting in this forum or the general forum obviously doesn't cost any points. I posted this issue in our forum, because it only involves our members. For topics relevant to TNBW members at large, the Premium or Free forums would be the appropriate venue.

I started the group using the old incentive system - get points by reviewing so you can spend them on posts - because I liked it. But if the TMS members prefer to make it a free site, that's easily changed.

Clear as mud now? smile

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Re: New change in point allocation/cost

I forgot to respond to Dagnee's comment re gaming the system. There may have been members who did what you described, but I didn't see a problem there. Rarely would I review a chapter that paid only a few points but ended up being quite long. So it did happen, but I doubt it was intentional. And an author who does that routinely will be quickly found out and punished by losing reviewers. Posting vs publishing is semantics; of course I meant posting content, not forum talk.

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6 Reply by cobber (edited by cobber 2014-11-17 17:52:16)

Re: New change in point allocation/cost

Well, I say keep it with points. I prefer posting to a group with others who like the genre and like the incentive the points provide.

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Re: New change in point allocation/cost

I vote for points.  Yesterday I finished a review in another group, and then found out I didn't get any points for it.  It takes time and effort to read and review thoughtfully, and it just feels good to be rewarded with points.  And I don't mind spending points to add to my work when I'm editing, if it keeps us all honest (not that any of us did that cheating thing).  As a matter of fact, I wondered why I didn't get charged when I added a paragraph or two.  I like having dollars to spend, and I like having points to spend, too.  JP

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