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sarah_scotti · 05-12-2008 05:58:16

For anyone who still needs the essay, here is the link: http://www.newyorker.com/archive/1996/0 … rentPage=2

WARNING: READING THESE COMMENTS BEFORE YOU READ THE ESSAY WILL GIVE AWAY SOMETHING YOU'LL BE DISAPPOINTED TO ALREADY KNOW!

Okay, got the spoiler alert out of the way...

First, let me say that this is one of my favorite essays of all time. This is actually the piece that first sparked my theory about creative nonfiction: In fiction, you want the reader to identify with the protagonist and so you really need to present just the experience without too much reflection. In creative nonfiction, though, you want the narrative voice to become the reader's aspirational friend, and part of creating that "friendship bond" with the reader is through reflection. You want not only "this is what happened" but also "and this is what I make of it." Because most of us lead lives that aren't, in and of themselves, particularly interesting. What makes them interesting is our understanding of them.

I think Beard does a great job of creating this friendship bond. I loved this essay from page one... the squirrels, the dogs, the beauty queen friend, and the guys in the physics lab. Her divorce and the amazingly self-absorbed man who is divorcing her. All of this would have been more than enough, and I don't know if I would have liked the essay any less if we didn't have Gang Lu shooting up the place 2/3 of the way into it. But we do, which leads us to the question of whether or not we think she does a good of writing about this huge, stunning event.

I fall totally into the "yes" category in terms of pacing and placement. I think it was the best possible choice to have this happen as it happened in her life... as a complete surprise, with very little foreshadowing and only after we were already in synch with the day-to-day realities of being JoAnn Beard. I have a few qualms about what I think must be the fictional account of Gang Lu's thoughts and actions during the shooting... but I imagine these are educated guesses, and as readers we understand that she can't really know what was going through his mind. I think the extremity of the situation makes the POV shift work.

I also think, and she may not even have meant this to be in there, that this is a fabulous and subtle piece about death: the sudden deaths of her collegues against the slow and arduous death of her collie. Gang Lu as the murderer out of spite, JoAnn as the (future) murderer out of compassion. For me, this dichotomy really brought the emotion of the piece to the fore.

What did you all get from reading this? Did you enjoy it? Did you find craft elements you'd like to discuss? Let the conversation commence! <grin>

Peace and all good things,
Sarah

aldersmith · 05-12-2008 06:35:37

I did enjoy this essay. I had to read it twice to get all of the characters straight and I enjoyed it more the second time around. The shoot up was quite a surprise and I liked how she prefaced and grounded the whole event with the everyday stuff.

I had a question about why her dogs are not named in the story and Chris' dog is named, twice as I recall. Do you have any thoughts regarding the author's intentions?

I felt like she could have brought out the aspect more that she was among the living because she was sent home. This aspect only hovered subtly IMO and I think the enormity of this factor should have been more pronounced. Could be just my interpretation of it.

All in all, a very stirring piece and one I won't soon forget.

sarah_scotti · 05-12-2008 08:19:55

I, too, noticed that she didn't name the dogs, and it worked for me. I thought it created a sense of intimacy... we knew these dogs not by their names, but by their personalities. Also, it brought out "The Face of Love" lines about the collie more strongly, which I thought was important and fed into the metaphorical role of the dog as an artifact of a marriage gone sour.

In reading this, I'm thinking that maybe I overthink things!

aldersmith · 05-12-2008 08:49:15

Did you also get a sense that she did some head popping? A couple of times she told us what Chris was thinking and I am not certain I am comfortable with that. I'm sure that is something my reviewers would be quick to point out in my work.

sarah_scotti · 05-12-2008 09:04:18

I did. Particularly with Gang Lu, but also with Chris. For me, it was clear this had to do with their being dead... no longer around to get input from on what they were thinking, so all that was left was to imagine it. The definate POV slips here seem to me to work only after you know that Chris is dead and that she is trying to make sense of things in the aftermath.

mishmont · 05-12-2008 14:12:29

Okay I finally found you all. this was in the other thread. I'm with you now, or would be if I weren't out the door. Back in four hours. I'll tell Dave hi. (where are the cookies?). I noticed the head popping too--a little distracting but maybe it was a "need to know" thing.

Are we discussing it here or on AIM? 4 o'clock PDT works for me.

Just finished reading it. Oh boy. The collie part is awfully close to home for me. It was two years, two weeks ago that we buried Meggi our collie. (Ch 30 of Diary for those of you who haven't read it--I wonder if I capture it as well).

this is a powerful piece of writing for sure. Because of the collie tie in, I am not sure I can be objective. I know this woman as though she is in my own skin and cannot stop crying for her (and myself).

We know her through the things she cares about which we find out through the rich descriptions.

aldersmith · 05-12-2008 14:19:57

Mish, I think I instantly relate to her too because of the dog thing. Smart writing to hook the reader at our points of reference. Some of us can relate to critters in the attic as well, very wisely done IMO.

sarah_scotti · 05-13-2008 06:01:30

I think she does the dog thing really well... and that it's something that can easily trip over into the sentimental, which she avoids. Another good dog essay that isn't really a dog essay is Brenda Miller's "The Blessing of the Animals."

How did you all feel about the way Beard dealt with the shootings? Were you comfortable with her telling us the whole thing as if she had seen it, although she was clearly recreating it from news and eye-witness accounts?

EllieO · 05-13-2008 08:22:01

Pay no attention to me. I took off yesterday to my son's house and thought I had the essay with me, but it was the wrong one. I was reading something about a cat and a mouse thinking 'when does the dog show up?'

Anyway, I hope to get caught up tonight, after I teach a first time homebuyer's workshop.

mishmont · 05-13-2008 08:52:51

EllieO wrote:
I was reading something about a cat and a mouse thinking 'when does the dog show up?'

sarah_scotti · 05-13-2008 18:17:50

Slowing down already?

How about we go back to some basics. Did you like this essay? Did you dislike it? Do you think you would have liked it even if Gang Lu hadn't gone in and shot everyone up? (My answer to this is yes, and maybe I would have liked it more... which is why I ask. I think in spite of the big event, the real strength of this essay is in it's every day detail, it's banal tragedies, not in it's overwhelming one.)

Also, any suggestions for how to help keep the conversation going?

pamelablack62 · 05-13-2008 18:33:02

Okay, sorry I'm late arriving. Stressing out about the rewrite and trying to make the deadline.

mishmont · 05-13-2008 18:37:31

Sarah, I agree with you that it would stand on its own. I was very surprised at the twist.

I could not at all feel it. We see these things to often these days that current readers might have a hard time. In fact, i was distracted by trying to remember which massacre this had been.

As a moral take-away the juxtaposition of the actions of one who applauds life and one who finds it worthless, it works IMO.
the collie is alive and being nurtured, the killer is dead.

She does not want to accept at this point she has the power of life or death, as does the evil one, or at least the one who has not been taught how to partake of life.

Thus endeth the lesson.

sarah_scotti · 05-13-2008 19:15:36

Pamela, you go meet your deadline! We'll be here when you've sealed the envelope and dropped it in the mail! For gosh sakes, it's about writing! <grin> Reading is just a tool.

aldersmith · 05-13-2008 20:29:30

I liked it, but I agree, I would have liked it more and even enjoyed a book length version w/ these characters without the shootings. I think the mundane "life" things tempered the shootings quite a bit in my opinion. I don't think I grasped the enormity of what had happened the way she told it for some reason. If she had built up the relationships more I think I would have easily cried, but I didn't in this short version which is unusual because usually something like this will make me sob like a baby. I like the way the matter thing tied it all together. But again, she was even in Gang Lu's head, a lot of head switching for a short piece.

sarah_scotti · 05-14-2008 06:46:11

Nancy,

This essay is from her wonderful book "The Boys of My Youth" and it is a lot more every day life-ish. "Bulldozing the Baby" is in there, and it's also a favorite of mine.

I actually like that this doesn't make me cry, because it gets me past that first emotion. This is part of what I mean by the "aspirational friend" thing. I don't feel like I'm Beard reading this, though I do feel like one of the people milling around her living room... a little uncomfortable, wishing I had some idea what to say or do but not having even a small clue, seeing grief from one step removed. I actually think that's a strength in her writing; she lets us step one giant step back from where we usually experience these things and see them in a new way.

#1 05-12-2008 05:58:16

Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#2 05-12-2008 06:35:37

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#3 05-12-2008 08:19:55

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#4 05-12-2008 08:49:15

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#5 05-12-2008 09:04:18

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#6 05-12-2008 14:12:29

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#7 05-12-2008 14:19:57

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#8 05-13-2008 06:01:30

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#9 05-13-2008 08:22:01

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#10 05-13-2008 08:52:51

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

EllieO wrote:

#11 05-13-2008 18:17:50

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#12 05-13-2008 18:33:02

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#13 05-13-2008 18:37:31

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#14 05-13-2008 19:15:36

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#15 05-13-2008 20:29:30

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

#16 05-14-2008 06:46:11

Re: Discussion: JoAnn Beard's "The Fourth State of Matter"

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