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HavePenWillScribble · 01-06-2006 13:46:56

When reviewing I have oft noted the wording following the stars. They always give me pause to think about their meanings. Since it niggles at my subconscious, I will attempt to convey my feelings about them, and maybe they will stop tormenting me. The following comments are how I grade novel chapters and short stories.

One star= I had to force myself to read past the first paragraph
=====I feel this is worthless and probably has no need of being here except to remind someone who had a two that it could have been worse. To issue this rating would be crass. The only justification would be to extract some vengeful satisfaction against the writer if the they gave you a similiar review. An emotional retaliation.

Two Stars= The work had interesting elements but it still needs a lot of development/editing/rewriting to be rated higher.
=====To give this review, the piece must have met very few requirements for readability. I would not do it without a thorough and in depth written analysis, with copius examples to explain my rating. Very likely, the 500 word review limit would hinder my ability to say all I wished to say. I try to offer constructive comments and provide animus for the writer to continue and to improve. Anything else is tantamount to telling the writer to find something else with which to occupy their time. A mean spirited and unnecessary exercise.

3 Stars= An average story. Writing and ideas were okay but it just didn't stand out from the pack.
=====A work which was written with a lackluster style, a casual inattention to detail and several disjointed turns and lurches. The writer is capable of better. Again a score of 3 should be accompanied by exacting and coherant explanations of the specific points which need to be addressed in order to improve the work.

4 Stars= A really good story. Well written but something is still lacking.
I reserve this for throwaway chapters in novels. usually well written but there to provide a little backstory and fulfill the wordcount. Every author uses them, I certainly do. Or if I have found a gaping hole, unresolvable loss of my suspension of disbelief or other major discordant note in an otherwise well done work. In a short story, the writer may have left a section in which contributed nothing I could discern.

5 Stars= Excellent. I couldn't stop reading. I won't forget it for awhile and I would have paid money to read it.

===== Excellent. I couldn't stop reading. I won't forget it for awhile.... I agree wholeheartedly with that wording. I take offense at the 'paid money to read it'. Quite obviously we all have a preferred choice of reading genres and styles. Out of the hundreds of books we are faced with on the shelves, there are very few which cause us to dig into our pockets and buy. Taking this literally I could rarely in good conscious award a five star rating. I do not make a beeline to the historical fiction section, perusing new releases. This bothered me until I decided to play the role of editor at a publishing house who is in charge of buying manuscripts. Armed with that comforting rationalization for the 5 star description, I carefully read the work. As a buyer, I am looking for readability, style, plot, conflict, and enjoyment. I do not detract points for punctuation or typos because that has nothing to do with the work. That is somebody elses job. (Unless it was riddled with them) I mention them, paste ones I noted in the review and go on in my role as buyer. Would this work appeal to my readers? Can our publishing house make a profit here. Will this enable me to keep my cushy job sitting on my duff and reading? Will my unearthing of this jewel get me a raise? Will the owner come down and invite me out for golf?
If the work meets the requirments, I award it the five, even though I am not the bodice ripper or space opera buying type.

We want to be entertained. We want to be taken away. We want to have an adventure. We crave distraction from the mundane, day to day events. Give us that, you get the five.
Anyway, that is how I interpret the stars and award them. Feel free to call me a certain type of mule... but please provide coherant statements to show why I am an $ss

Last edited by HavePenWillScribble (01-06-2006 13:48:01)

jennifer · 01-06-2006 13:50:37

No, I think you are absolutely correct. We're all here to learn, to get better, and the only way we can do that is to have straightforward, honest feedback. It may not be perfect- but what work ever is?- but it's our job to help make it better. I like your idea of reading like you're looking for the greatest sale of your career; I might just borrow that. It's an interesting way to look at things.

Nice.

Westwitch · 01-06-2006 15:36:08

The horoscope of poetry - assigning stars

One Star: This was dashed off by one who most probably has not read much poetry and might consider taking the cost of membership here as contribution toward the purchase of a dictionary, thesaurus, and Gregg Reference Manual of Grammar - This person cannot spell so good yo. Let it be said, however, that every 1-star poem has the potential to achieve 2-ness, but it's going to take a bit of a stretch.

Two Stars: This poem is breaking through the skin of poetry. There might be an inkling of poetic structure, perhaps an image thrown in, only one or two spelling or grammar errors. There might be something here to build on if the poet takes the advice generously offered and is grateful for the time spent in analysis. Some regard for meter and rhyme is present, but awkward. A wistful eye toward 3-dom is cast.

Three Stars: A poem with potential. This poem has the makings of something beautiful, powerful, poignant. Perhaps it is lacking in depth, deviates from the structure it attempts to follow, or falls short of following through on a metaphor. There is much to work with here, and with careful attention to word choice, a clear vision of the message the poet wishes to convey, it can be reworked into something very valuable - even beautiful.

Four Stars: This poem is good. It has some flaws that can be easily repaired. This poem is marching pointedly in the direction of 5-land, which is only a few careful steps away. The poet should read all reviews thoughtfully, consider the advice, accept or reject it, but rework it into something of beauty, economy, complexity or lovely simplicity.

Five Stars: This is a complete work. If there are small technical difficulties that are outweighed by the intensity of emotion, complexity of image, or depth of thought the poem evokes - so be it. There is no 4.75, so the reviewer should err on the side of 5. A true bonafide 5 is a work that could be analyzed in a high school English class because it contains many elements of poetry - metaphor, simile, meter, rhyme, free verse, deep meaning, thoughtful philosophy or delightful humor. This work is publishable. It moves the reader and reveals the heart and soul of the poet.

And that's all she wrote.

Last edited by Westwitch (01-06-2006 22:36:29)

barry n davidson · 01-07-2006 07:25:05

HavePen,

I think I love you. The description of what deserves a 5 star was superior. Do you mind terribly if I send a copy of that to several people I know on other sites?

HavePenWillScribble · 01-07-2006 07:52:47

If my incoherent ramblings above may fit somewhere in the mass of misinformation that has congealed to form the 'web', possibly some little viewed nook on a fake rolex peddlers site, feel free to use it. I doubt it sees much use, as it's prurient content is slight. On a side note: the joking opening salvo, expressing some mild form of adulation has sent me fleeing to my cave.
Har!

Westwitch, your companion post on poetic star alignment was a 'silver bullet' I shall keep in my arsenal of meager poetry observation skills.

mike b · 01-07-2006 10:09:31

HPWS,

Preach it, Brother! Preach it! Can I get an "amen"? AMEN!

About all I can add is that I don't count off for minor typos, because I am not a copy editor. I am beginning to suspect, however, that I am an editor, and so for short stories I try to look at it with an editor's eye. The things most likely to get a "2" from me are the things that would cause an editor to toss the manuscript into the "send the form rejection letter" pile, rather than put it into his "pay cash now" pile. Two of the most common things that trigger a 2 are changing POV without signaling and using word without regard to nuance.

Good work on defining the stars.

Annie · 01-08-2006 08:38:36

I'll give you your AMEN and raise you a Praise the all mightly!
I agree whole heartily! I'm probably going to get slammed for this but sometimes i feel there is a poularity contest going on.

Selah Cooper-Holl · 01-08-2006 09:06:18

I see your Amen and your Praise the Almighty and fold. I know a winning hand when I see one and both HPWS and Westwitch have made their points.
I wish there was a way we could grade on different portions to more clearly illustrate why we are giving a particular 'constellation'. For example, when reading a short story I am looking for a piece that can be read in one sitting and has essentially, all of the elements of a novel. That is: character development, setting, theme, symbolism and plot. How can I look at a beautifully drawn character who doesn't do anything? How can I read a gorgeous plot when I am unable to determine even the gender of the protagonist?

I think most of the people who post their work here are very talented. Speaking strictly for myself, I feel I can do dialogue a whole lot better than other areas that are more difficult for me. So someone reading my work and giving me a 3 star on a short story because they didn't like one very small aspect seems kind of, I don't know, horrible.

Selah Cooper-Holl · 01-08-2006 09:08:42

mike b wrote:
HPWS,

Two of the most common things that trigger a 2 are changing POV without signaling and using word without regard to nuance.

Good work on defining the stars.

O.K. I get the changing POV part (*I* am notorious for head hopping) but could you explain "using word without regard to nuance"?

mike b · 01-09-2006 00:20:40

Selah,

Head hopping isn't bad, IF it is on purpose and there is a good reason AND it is done well Theodore Sturgeon’s book Godbody is done in first person from seven different people, usually covering events from both sides. It is an amazing book, worthy of being read for a number of reasons (I personally had a religious epiphany, but your mileage may vary). Spider Robinson’s book Mind Killer hopped between to different first person POVs. If you are in omni-view, you can be wherever you want. It all can work, if done well and with intent.

Where I have a problem is when the story is cruising along in first person, then suddenly shifts to third person. I can understand this happening in a rough draft. But before a rough draft gets posted the author should read it over with an editor’s eye, and fix things like that. I, personally not only read it, but I read it aloud, and usually read it aloud to my wife before I post it. I am hoping that people will read my work and offer me constructive criticism, and I want to have that aimed at things I couldn’t see, not things I could.

As for disregarding nuances, let me give you an example: “He hit the knight squarely in the visage.� “Visage� means face, and that is what the author was trying to say, using archaic language for flavor. But “visage� is more the look or appearance of the face, not the actual physical face. You can gaze on someone’s visage, but you can’t hit them in the visage. Another example would be, “The boat was tossed by the raging zephyr.� As I am sure you know (but the author did not) zephyrs do not rage. And even if they did, wind doesn’t toss a boat, waves do.

I think part of my complaint about not paying attention to nuance is that in most stories there is an element of mystery or problem solving, and the reader is looking for clues so they can figure it out. If the author can’t use words correctly, one cannot be sure if a particular highly nuanced word is a clue, or just incorrectly used.

#1 01-06-2006 13:46:56

How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#2 01-06-2006 13:50:37

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#3 01-06-2006 15:36:08

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#4 01-07-2006 07:25:05

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#5 01-07-2006 07:52:47

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#6 01-07-2006 10:09:31

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#7 01-08-2006 08:38:36

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#8 01-08-2006 09:06:18

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

#9 01-08-2006 09:08:42

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

mike b wrote:

#10 01-09-2006 00:20:40

Re: How one reviewer interprets the star systems alignment

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